new gismu: "intended for / purpose"

[solpahi]

Add a new gismu with the following place structure:

"x1 has purpose x2 (property); x1 is supposed for use x2 (property); x1 is intended as x2 (property)."

(add "by x3" if necessary.)

This gismu is badly needed in my opinion.

[xorxes]

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 12:50 PM, selpahi notifications@github.com wrote:

Add a new gismu with the following place structure:

"x1 has purpose x2 (property); x1 is supposed for use x2 (property); x1 is
intended as x2 (property)."

(add "by x3" if necessary.)

This gismu is badly needed in my opinion.

Isn't that pretty much what "tutci" means though?

[durka]

The definition of {tutci} seems very physical ("form determines function")
to me. It sounds like selpa'i wants a word closer to {zilzukte} perhaps. Or
{tutci} could be broadened but that may be incompatible with usage.
On Jun 5, 2014 5:59 PM, "xorxes" notifications@github.com wrote:

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 12:50 PM, selpahi notifications@github.com wrote:

Add a new gismu with the following place structure:

"x1 has purpose x2 (property); x1 is supposed for use x2 (property); x1
is
intended as x2 (property)."

(add "by x3" if necessary.)

This gismu is badly needed in my opinion.

Isn't that pretty much what "tutci" means though?

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#33 (comment).

[solpahi]

la .xorxes. cu cusku di'e

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 12:50 PM, selpahi notifications@github.com wrote:

Add a new gismu with the following place structure:

"x1 has purpose x2 (property); x1 is supposed for use x2 (property);
x1 is
intended as x2 (property)."

(add "by x3" if necessary.)

This gismu is badly needed in my opinion.

Isn't that pretty much what "tutci" means though?

{tutci} comes closest from all the gismu, but it's a bit of a stretch to
think of anything with a purpose as a tool or resource. It can be done,
but I'd prefer to keep the two things apart (tutci as concrete, and
broda as abstract)

I'm thinking of:

• the reason for which something exists or is done, made, used, etc.

• an intended or desired result; end; aim; goal.

  mi zbasu lo ro'ixra noi broda lo ka lo prenu cu catlu ce'u ca lo nu
  cadzu pa'o lo tcadu midju
  "I built a statue which people are intended to look at while walking
  through the town center."

I'm not sure it's obviously a {tutci} in this case.

I think {tutci} implies an event of {pilno} at some point, while {broda}
can include any relation, not just {pilno}.

mi'e la selpa'i

[xorxes]

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 7:19 PM, selpahi notifications@github.com wrote:

la .xorxes. cu cusku di'e

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 12:50 PM, selpahi notifications@github.com
wrote:

Add a new gismu with the following place structure:

"x1 has purpose x2 (property); x1 is supposed for use x2 (property);
x1 is
intended as x2 (property)."

Isn't that pretty much what "tutci" means though?

I think {tutci} implies an event of {pilno} at some point, while {broda}
can include any relation, not just {pilno}.

So "tutci" is too utilitarian? You did say "supposed for use x2" though.
Then "tutci" could be defined in terms of "broda" as:

ko'a tutci ko'e := ko'a broda lo ka zi'o pilno ce'u ko'e

[lagleki]

pe'i lo bai zei sumtcita cu si'a jai sarcu iseki'ubo ei cuxna lo na se
pilno tarmi cmavo valsi

i mi fliba lo ka facki tu'a lo banzu ke rarna bangu gloso

i e'uru'e zo telki noi se krasi zo'oi teleology ije zo te'i sumtcita da'i

2014-06-05 19:50 GMT+04:00 selpahi notifications@github.com:

Add a new gismu with the following place structure:

"x1 has purpose x2 (property); x1 is supposed for use x2 (property); x1 is
intended as x2 (property)."

(add "by x3" if necessary.)

This gismu is badly needed in my opinion.

You can merge this Pull Request by running

git pull https://github.com/selpahi/gimste patch-19

Or view, comment on, or merge it at:

#33
Commit Summary

• new gismu: "intended for"

File Changes

• A gismu/new gismu: "intended for"
  https://github.com/balningau/gimste/pull/33/files#diff-0 (7)

Patch Links:

• https://github.com/balningau/gimste/pull/33.patch
• https://github.com/balningau/gimste/pull/33.diff

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#33.

[solpahi]

la gleki cu cusku di'e

pe'i lo bai zei sumtcita cu si'a jai sarcu iseki'ubo ei cuxna lo na se
pilno tarmi cmavo valsi

nitcu lo bai zei sumtcita ma .i xu pensi lo mupli te pilno

i mi fliba lo ka facki tu'a lo banzu ke rarna bangu gloso

i e'uru'e zo telki noi se krasi zo'oi teleology ije zo te'i sumtcita da'i

su'o da stidi lo du'u zo te'i dunli lu to'e nenri li'u noi co'e lu fi'o
se bartu li'u

[lagleki]

2014-06-06 12:19 GMT+04:00 selpahi notifications@github.com:

la gleki cu cusku di'e

pe'i lo bai zei sumtcita cu si'a jai sarcu iseki'ubo ei cuxna lo na se
pilno tarmi cmavo valsi

nitcu lo bai zei sumtcita ma .i xu pensi lo mupli te pilno

lo cidja = lo sete'i se citka

i au tordu

i mi fliba lo ka facki tu'a lo banzu ke rarna bangu gloso

i e'uru'e zo telki noi se krasi zo'oi teleology ije zo te'i sumtcita da'i

su'o da stidi lo du'u zo te'i dunli lu to'e nenri li'u noi co'e lu fi'o
se bartu li'u

ko pilno lu sene'i li'u i mi na jimpe lodu'u makau krinu lo nu bi'unai stidi

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#33 (comment).

[adamlopresto]

So either gleki's understanding of the proposed gismu is wrong, or mine is, but I would see "lo cidja = lo sete'i se citka" as completely wrong. It seems like there are two similar, but different, concepts being talked about here.

broda: x1 was intended for use/purpose x2 (ka) by x3
brode: x1 is suitable for/affords use/is useful as x2 (ka)

Wild mushrooms brode being eaten, but there's no broda3. They were intended for that use by any actual intentional agent. Likewise a naturally occurring stone of a certain shape and size which makes a great impromptu bench. On the flip side, you can have a sculpture that's was designed for peaceful reflection, but is actually used and useful as a shelter from wind and rain.

The definitions proposed sound to me like broda (other than the fact that "supposed for" sounds really odd to my ear), but I can see how one could also see it as brode. Which is it?

[solpahi]

la xalbo cu cusku di'e

So either gleki's understanding of the proposed gismu is wrong, or mine
is, but I would see "lo cidja = lo sete'i se citka" as completely wrong.

Agreed.

It seems like there are two similar, but different, concepts being
talked about here.

broda: x1 was intended for use/purpose x2 (ka) by x3
brode: x1 is suitable for/affords use/is useful as x2 (ka)

Wild mushrooms brode being eaten, but there's no broda3. They were
intended for that use by any actual intentional agent. Likewise a
naturally occurring stone of a certain shape and size which makes a
great impromptu bench. On the flip side, you can have a sculpture that's
was designed for peaceful reflection, but is actually used and useful as
a shelter from wind and rain.

The definitions proposed sound to me like broda (other than the fact
that "supposed for" sounds really odd to my ear), but I can see how one
could also see it as brode. Which is it?

It's broda, not brode. brode sounds like {mapti}/{xamgu}.

[lagleki]

ie mi pu srera
no'i e'u zo tseli e zo te'i

Czech: cíl
Esperanto: celo
German: Ziel
Hungarian: cél
Polish: cel
Russian: [tsel']
Greek: τελος

2014-06-06 18:56 GMT+04:00 selpahi notifications@github.com:

la xalbo cu cusku di'e

So either gleki's understanding of the proposed gismu is wrong, or mine
is, but I would see "lo cidja = lo sete'i se citka" as completely wrong.

Agreed.

It seems like there are two similar, but different, concepts being
talked about here.

broda: x1 was intended for use/purpose x2 (ka) by x3
brode: x1 is suitable for/affords use/is useful as x2 (ka)

Wild mushrooms brode being eaten, but there's no broda3. They were
intended for that use by any actual intentional agent. Likewise a
naturally occurring stone of a certain shape and size which makes a
great impromptu bench. On the flip side, you can have a sculpture that's
was designed for peaceful reflection, but is actually used and useful as
a shelter from wind and rain.

The definitions proposed sound to me like broda (other than the fact
that "supposed for" sounds really odd to my ear), but I can see how one
could also see it as brode. Which is it?

It's broda, not brode. brode sounds like {mapti}/{xamgu}.

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#33 (comment).

[sisima70]

Could a "pilno cupra" seljvajvo solve this? I think it can, but I'll have to double-check CLL first.
I also consider "tepi'o" to mean "for purpose ...", rather than "a tool usage for purpose ...".

[lagleki]

Also see finti and tefi'e

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On Wed, Aug 14, 2019, 02:35 sisima70 ***@***.***> wrote: Could a "pilno cupra" seljvajvo solve this? I think it can, but I'll have to double-check CLL first. I also consider "tepi'o" to mean "for purpose ...", rather than "a tool usage for purpose ...". — You are receiving this because you commented. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <#33?email_source=notifications&email_token=AASNCEOTS76AP7XPFQDJYVDQENAM5A5CNFSM4AQGAECKYY3PNVWWK3TUL52HS4DFVREXG43VMVBW63LNMVXHJKTDN5WW2ZLOORPWSZGOD4HI6TQ#issuecomment-521047886>, or mute the thread <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AASNCEN4PQIQAL2UJIQEO5DQENAM5ANCNFSM4AQGAECA> .